Police misconceptions

**DISCALIMER - THIS IS INTENDED AS A GUIDE / INFORMATION ONLY, AND IS NOT INTENDED AS LEGAL ADVICE. SHOULD YOU FEEL YOU ARE IN A SITUATION WHERE LEGAL ADVICE MAY BE REQUIRED, PLEASE SEEK ADVICE FROM A LEGAL PROFESSIONAL**

Ok, this is the second time I've written this - the first time the page timed out and I lost it all! Damn it!

Im going to try and dispel some myths concerning the Police and why we do what we do. I have done it in bullit points to try and seperate issues. If you want anything answered, let me know and I'll try my best.

If this is in the wrong place then I apologise, and ask that a mod move it to wherever it needs to go!

TARGETS

Police are NOT given targets for the issuing of tickets. Never have done, never will be. If we were, they'd be chaos at the end of each month as people tried to get their quota in. Up until very recently, we did have performance targets, but they were to do with detected crimes, of which very few traffic offeces are detectable.

WHY YOU GET STOPPED

The most common reason is driving like an idiot, or being reported by Joe Bloggs public for driving like an idiot (even if you weren't, its their perception of your driving). Also bear in mind that CCTV operators will monitor you should they see you driving in a manner that makes them suspicious, and will report you to the Police too. I understand the desire to show of your pride and joy, or the noise your exhaust makes (especially if you have spent a lot on it like I will be on mine soon), however the main st of a town is not the best place to do this! If we use the Parade in Leamington as an example, I've seen cars flooring it between Warwick St and Regent St to get their exhaust to pop - doing it on a busy Saturday afternoon with people shopping (or at night when there is a risk of drunks falling in the road infront of you) is likely to get you a speaking to! The other main reason is in the past, people who have modded their cars have done so on a pocket fluff and peanut budget - i.e. on the cheap. They have tended to mod their cars themselves, whilst not really knowing what they are doing, meaning that their cars are death traps to either themselves, or other road users/pedestrians as the bits they have stuck on with gaffer tape and superglue (yes, I've seen it!) fall off! Its also been known for people who drive modded cars to spend a lot of money on their mods, but spend nothing on things like legal tyres / insurance / MOT and Tax. If you get stopped and you know that you have been driving legally (within the speed limit / conditions, not like a knob) then the stop may just be to check the sorts of things above. Its also worth mentioning that if you are out driving, and your car is 5 up (all males or a mixture of males and females - all females seem to attract less attention for some reason), especially at night, you increase the chances of getting stopped. This IS NOT because of your car, it is more a crime prevention aspect. I wont go into it here, as its off topic.

ATTITUDE

I cant stress this enough - in a lot of cases, the way that you get dealt with if you are stopped boils down to YOUR attitude to the Police Officer, from the moment you engage in conversation. If you are arsey with them, its a surefire way of getting a ticket. If you are arsey and have a potty mouth, you will probably get a ticket for the origial pull, plus an £80 public order ticket or a trip to the local custody suite. If I stop you, and you are polite and respectful, then the chances of me giving you a ticket are slim. The example I'll use is imagine you are at work, doing your job. You have to speak to someone concerning work (placing an order, serving a customer, whatever) - if the first thing they do when you speak to them is get shitty with you, then it will automatically get your back up, no? Obviously there will be times when you get the copper who has had a bad day and is arsey with you - all I'd suggest is smile, take it on the chin and let him have his say. Lowering to their level just gives more ammo to them. There will be times that no matter how nice you are, how respectful or how polite you are, you will get a ticket. From a personal perspective, there is nothing I hate more than being taken for a fool and lied to - that just pisses me off (if its blatent, and we both know it). An example - speaking to obviously drunk 15 year olds in the park (yes, we've all done it) - Me; "Have you been drinking?", reply; "No offichers, not at all...Hic!" (ok, probably a bad example, but all I could come up with in regards to 'blatently obvious'!). From a personal point of view, treat me as above, and the chances ofgetting a ticket are slim.

COMPLAINTS AND 'BLACKLISTING'

Unless you are part of the MI5 / MI6, SOCA or various other 'secret' government departments, your car will not get blacklisted if you complain, meaning you cant be stopped. This is a myth. However, it wont also show up as belonging to someone who has complained, leading to being treated differently from others.

MODS AND INSURANCE

If you have an engine mod (new cams / pistons etc) that improves performance (I think this stretches to aftermarket alloys as well, but Im not too sure) then you must declare it to your insurance company. If you dont, and you have an accident (a prpoer one, not a slight bump) then should your mods get discovered, your insurance will become null and void and you will find a summons landing on your doormat. Insurance assessors are very good at picking up things (or the ones I've had to deal with are). I'm aware of people dropping 2.0 engines in a 1.2 Corsa body, but not telling the DVLA / insurance company. If I stop you and find you havent decalred your mods, I will inform your insurance company, and as soon as they tell me your policy is null, I will remove your car from the road under S152 of the Road Traffic Act. The Police have a massive amount of data available to them on you, your car and your insurance. We have access to 24/7 Police Liason within certain insurance companies, who can access your policy and describe any mods declared so I can check what i have at the road side. We also have access to the MiB (Motor Insurers Bureau) who can tell us your insurance state. On PNC we have access to your chassis and engine numbers to verify against your VRM..... Should these not match up, you may find yourself locked up for various offences - mismatching VIN's can be a sign of a stolen vehicle....

DRIVING UNDER THE INFLUENCE OF DRINK / DRUGS

Simple. Dont do it. The Police can require you to provide a sample of breath at the roadside using a handheld breath kit. Typically these use a traffic light system, with a reading of your alcohol level. You will normally get about 3 attempts to provide an adequate sample. If you dont, you will get arrested anyway for 'Failing to Provide'. Green means you are ok. Yellow is a warning and you would probably be advised not to drive, as any alcohol not already in your system could tip you over the limit in 10 mins time. Red is a fail. Fail and you will be arrested and taken to the nick. Once there you will be booked into custody as normal and put on an intox machine (basically a bigger, more accurate version of the roadside kit). You will be asked to provide 2 samples of breath. THe machine will give a print out of both samples, and give your alcohol reading. You will be charged on the lower of the two readings. However, certain forces will only prosecute if you are over a certain limit (for example, the legal limit is 35 microgrammes of alcohol per 100ml - my force wont prosecute you if you are over 35mg but under an 'upper limit'. Im not going to make mention of what that limit is so I dont encourage people to give it a go!). You will normally be given three attempts to provide. If you dont then you will be charged with 'Failing to Provide'. Once the officer has got to this stage of deciding to charge you for this offence, you wont get a chance to 'have another go'.
You can only be asked to provide a breath sample if there is a belief you may be driving under the influence (excessive weaving, driving far too fast, driving far too slowly/cautiously, commiting traffic offences etc). However, you can be stopped for a document check / to make sure you are the correct keeper / driver, and be B-Tested on your mannerisms / actions in the car (are you slurring your words, are your pupils glazed over, does the car smell of booze?). Should a breath kit not be available, or there is suspicion that you have been smoking something you shouldnt have, then you can be arrested under S4 of the Road Traffic Act - Unfit to Drive Through Drink or Drugs. In both cases (drink drive / unfit to drive) there is an option to have a urine or blood sample taken (although in drink drive cases this is normally only because you have a medical condition meaning you cant muster enough breath to provide a sample).

SECTION 59 WARNINGS

Section 59 warnings are placed on both you, and your car. THis means that should you drive like a plum in your car and get a warning, get caught driving like a plum in your mates car, and your mate loses his car. The same goes for your car - if your mate gets caught driving like a tool in your car (which already has a warning on it) then you lose your car. The general misconception is that once you have had your car removed, your warnings are 'reset', thus allowing you to have more warnings. Not true. The warnings stay, meaning as soon as you get your car back, you could lose it again for driving like a knob.

NUMBER PLATES

I know this is a bone of contention! If you are displaying a number plate that doesnt conform, the chances are you will be stopped and given a VDRS (Vehicle Defect Rectification notice). Why are Police so 'hot' on number plates? Because, in a nut shell, amongst other things, should your car get nicked, it helps in getting it back. The country is awash with ANPR (Automatic Number Plate Recognition) cameras - I can pretty much gurantee that you could leave Lands End and drive to John O'Groats and the Polcie could track you the length of the country most of the way. These cameras can (and do) read illegal plates, however, it just takes a bit more time to analyse the data. Im sure I saw a thread on here somewhere concerning a stolen car in Humberside, but that was picked up in Surrey by their ANPR system.....

NOISE LIMITS

This is one area I am not 100% sure on. I popped into work last night to pick up some stuff stores had sent through for me, and while there I checked the PNLDB to try and get some clarification. There is very little relating to noise limits, however, the legislation does say something along the lines of the noise must be deemed reasonable for the vehicle. As I say, without trawlling through pages of legislation, Im not 100% sure, so please, please, dont quote me. Just be aware that there are also Construction and Use regs that you may fall foul of if your exhaust is massivly loud!

thats all I can think of at the moment - if I've missed anything, let me know and I'll clarify / add accordingly! Also be aware that every situation is different, as is every officer!

Good advice there.

Alex the kid wrote: Good advice there.

+1
was an interesting read, thanks mate

All seems very fair.

And I wish the police would be a bit more proactive at fining people going up and down Leamington Spa parade on busy days. The behaviour of some drivers there is beyond belief, with people booting it in second and third up the high street, on really busy days. There are families with young children, old people, etc - it's just a disaster waiting to happen, yet I don't think I've ever seen an officer there.

I personally think an officer with a radar gun, and a police bike waiting round the corner to issue tickets would see people re-evaluate how they drive in busy areas like the parade.

even if i do as you've said i still get pulled, for no reason!!!!!!!!!!!!

chicaneuk wrote: And I wish the police would be a bit more proactive at fining people going up and down Leamington Spa parade on busy days. The behaviour of some drivers there is beyond belief, with people booting it in second and third up the high street, on really busy days.

Agreed to the point of that its now that pedestrianised i cant see why its not Buses and taxis only during certain hours. Obviously would be a logistical nightmare to sort this out but its gotta be better than the traffic light grand prix that goes on at the weekends

surely engine mods are the critical one being declared. body kits and other things in my opinion dont make any difference they dont make your car faster or improve it in anyway.

The problem is, that over the course of the last few years, things have got out of hand with regards to the booting it up and down the Parade - I remember when I still lived in Leam and read the Courier that there was some issue concerning "boy racers" (I am quoting from the paper - I think thats the term they used) coming to Leam from elsewhere (was it Banbury? Cant remember). Anyway, everyone gets tarred with the same brush - same with Police (we're all wankers apparently - although Im hoping that I am showing some of us are appraochable!) - when you hit that stage, it is very, very difficult to pull it back. But, it can be done. Its about trying to be a bit more open and trying to see everyones point of view / reasoning. Im not sure if it was you guys here, or another forum / community, that organised the drive through town followed by the meet on the pump room gardens about 2 years ago? That went down well - why? Because it gave people (locals, Police etc) the chance to actually see you for the enthusiasts you (we) are, rather than "boy racers" who all drive like idiots and are negative to any form of input. I think Im rambling off on a tangent here, but I hope you 9at least kind of) get my drift?

DMilsey wrote: even if i do as you've said i still get pulled, for no reason!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tickets issued? Do you have something on your car that could be spoken to you about (I see in your sig you have a blue tinge to your lights - its not an issue, however, it might be a little thing like that). The number of people stopped for their number plates who say "Yes, I know its too small". So, change it, dont get stopped! (Just using that as an example - nothing more)

richie wrote: surely engine mods are the critical one being declared. body kits and other things in my opinion dont make any difference they dont make your car faster or improve it in anyway.

Its not just performance as I understand it (and this is why Im not 100% sure about the alloys) - its about anything that could make your car more desirable to thieves, and therefore put you more at risk. Like I say, Im not 100% certain on this, as each insurance co is different. You could alsways just call and tell them you're thinking of having a bodykit / new alloys etc and see what they say. You dont have to tell them who you are as you're not talking about your specific policy!

Hi the bit regardin the pump room gardens is a event called the leamington 100 a charity event that we run every year in its 3rd year this yeah and due to be a massive event this time round